Why does BFME have stun/net spells? (Also: RQ)

Rizel said:
The games you are describing takes far too long for a custom game on wc3. a game like that sounds like it would take the very least 3 hours with people who knew anything...... Warcraft 3 doesn't fit with such a ''grand strategy game''  Try ride of eorl or War of the third age, there's tons of maps that dont really favour heroes but rather have them act as leaders. they never took off cause people thought they were boring and slow, which they are. (or incredibly unbalanced)
edit: also having more than 2 teams is a horrible idea, that isn't balance. It's a ''cop out'' to prevent having to balance, person X says team 1 is totally imba and rolls any race easy the default strategy will then be team 2 and 3 must double team 1 to even have a chance of coming to the climax of the game (winning it)
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better not be dissing wotj
 
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better not be dissing wotj
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You can also compensate by everything being imba and having ridicolously strong towers, but the point of a map he woukld make is to not have strong heroes so.
 
I was saying that if you have 3 teams there will be a propensity for the other two to ally against one team once that team starts being successful.

Keeping the map size low ought to reduce the game time. Even with slower armies. ::)

 
1. I think you are incredibly ignorant to the current state of bfme and the importance of army, and army positioning. Though there could possibly be a bit more macro (tending bases and all taht) the current map has a good balance of macro,micro,positioning and decision making, heroes play an important roles yes. But it would be boring without them. Not to talk about that you didn't have any idea that it actually was a ''rock paper scissor'' system of a kind already in bfme.

2. I think you should become better at the game before trying to actually balance a map, not being good or asking good players about balance and gameplay will make you ignorant to things that are rigged or can be exploited.  Your versions of whatever map you make will most likely probably be incredbly imbalanced and will take a ton of versions to get near a balanced map, and when people get better you will have to rebalance the map totally again. ( as we have done with bfme)

3. The map you are describing would require a totally different map from the one bfme curreently has cause its not enough terrain to use. The map you want to make; No map that i have played that tried to be like you are describing about positioning and all that have been successful, every decent strategy map like bfme, rw,lord tactics, etc have had heroes be a central and important part of it. I see the most likely outcome if you actually got an old or current version of bfme is taht you started mapping it, realized that whatever map you want to make will take far too long time and too much balance work and terrain editing, that you simply will make a nub friendly version of the current bfme with high hp bases, slower ms, less stuns, nearly no collission on heroes(so they cant get surrounded) siege dm removed etc. Basically make it more nub friendly.

4. You don't have any idea how much work it would be to actually map, and all the bugs and errors that randomly generate, not to talk about all the triggers you would have to edit to fit into your new fantastic map.

5.There are so many flaws in the posts you currently have about how to balance it that it would take probably more than half an hour to pick all of them out and present the flaw of it, here's a short one though; KonradT said: But then 3 teams will be better in order to allow autobalancing if one team is too strong.
So you want to punish a good team/players by making the two other teams win. You want one of the weaker teams to win the match instead of the team that has been dominating all game and outplaying the others. Cause thats what i would do if it was 3 teams, and i were on one of the weak ones, I would team up with the other weak team to take down the strong one. Since this is what you're suggesting is autobalance, which is fucking ridicolous since if a game is balanced the strongest team should win 90% of the time unless some strange or bad decision happens (which is what the other 10% is for)

Alright that's it im done for now. If you have any more ideas or objections I will be happy to respond to you another time.

-Love, Rizel

 
Stuns and nets are a part of the game. Its also one of the only things I am good at =) Taking out heroes pewpewpew. W/O any of those spells it would make it so hard to kill heroes and take the fun out of the game. What would be the point of naz w/o them?
 
You could try playing WottA 4.9 ( Has everything you'd like, but still retains the same concept with killing other player's heroes )
Units also move really slow in this map just like BFME.
Stuns are 3x1.00 instead of 3.00x1 Spell in WottA ( timing needs to be more accurate to keep a unit locked in one spot )


You can edit BFME 3.2 if you got mpqmaster/rmpq/vexorian 4.9c/newgen/silk object console/

It's not "protected," just longer to read everything and check them all.

As long as Storm.dll can read the file, it's not "protected". ( Map needs to be read by Storm.dll to run it in Wc3 )
 
ChoiYeonSung said:
You can edit BFME 3.2 if you got mpqmaster/rmpq/vexorian 4.9c/newgen/silk object console/

It's not "protected," just longer to read everything and check them all.

As long as Storm.dll can read the file, it's not "protected". ( Map needs to be read by Storm.dll to run it in Wc3 )
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ye its not hard to remove "protection" we dont use the wc3 opt as an protector that would be retarded considering its jsut an optimizer, we thus use it as an optimizer becosue it reduces the size of the map around 20% wich is great.


and as suggested he can play wotta, or otherwise if you want strategic heavy gameplay i suggest other games, wc3 is better for tactical gameplay and not really strategic imo...
 
it's mostly for speeding up load times

silkobjectconsole has two functions( one is to reverse the process, making it readable for editing, and the other makes load times quicker ) ( not really necessary if you just want to edit a few things via replacing some textfiles )
rmpq mostly for getting a listfile for mpqmaster
 
@ Rizel

1. I knew there was some and I was talking about the relative importance.

2. I'm good at Total War games. I'm not trying to balance it, I'm trying to change the gameplay, it's different.

3. I don't think it takes huge wide plains. I'm pretty sure a map half the size of 3.1 with urban terrain (houses and streets and so on) can can make a good tactically-engaging map.

4. Yep.

5. I think weak players teaming up is a good idea. If  they can, then the balance of power in the map will actually not depend on the skill of the players. And so the outcome of the game will be less predetermined. And I think that if the outcome is predetermined as it usually is in TeamVTeam games, by player skill, then that's a bad thing and takes away the fun of playing before the game is over and all bases are destroyed.
^^

@ Choi
I could probably search for ways of unlocking uneditable maps, but that would be rude.
 
And I think that if the outcome is predetermined as it usually is in TeamVTeam games, by player skill, then that's a bad thing and takes away the fun of playing before the game is over and all bases are destroyed.

i loled so hard.. why play a game if doesnt take skill..
where would the fun come from is every random retard could come in and win the game..
 
indeed why should a weak team win over a good team?
nothing is more frustrating when you know you did so much better then your opponent and you stil lost cause of imbalance/luck/teammates or other stuf like that
 
I used to play WotTA a LOT, but now I cant find any bots that host it... If you know of any pleaseeee pst me with em i'd love to get back into that game.
 
Hows it boring? I remember it had the same number of players BFME has now. Just no one had a bot to host it. Same as BFME cept no elves, just yellow with ents and Haldir who could summon. It was pretty sick... You guys should think about adding mines into back of Rohan.
 
Proudmoore101 said:
Hows it boring? I remember it had the same number of players BFME has now. Just no one had a bot to host it. Same as BFME cept no elves, just yellow with ents and Haldir who could summon. It was pretty sick... You guys should think about adding mines into back of Rohan.
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I can host games normally so I'll host it if you wanna play soon :) I'm "Konradt" on Eu and East. We could WotTA RP lol. Or BFME RP, not using heroes or something.

@Turin - game = decided by thinking skills, not clicking skills. So it won't be retards. Sometimes I wondered if 4 people from the real military + their CO played in one team, drilled in moving armies and heroes in 99% synchrony but still meek with reflexes like non-clan people, and then played on Bnet under the CO's leadership; if these could beat Bnet gamers.  ::)

 
what version of wotta is the newest? I made a version after i think Aero left (i have 3.2T from epicwar). But i noticed it got made into the 4.x series so did someone else pick it up or did Aerovox make a return?!
 
so i can turn around what you say.. i have a perfect team we can do everything synchron to 100% without even talking because we know each other so well - that means we should be better soldiers even tho we are lets say bad at sports and dont have and military training?

and the best thinking brings you nothing if you cant do it - another example
lets say japan have a perfect strategy to conquer the enitre world - if they had 3.000.000 more soldiers, so what would that bring them if they dont have them?
besides comparing reallife stuf with games is kinda zz in the first place
 
erh... for exemple

STARCRAFT IS a game that require fast apm and alot of thinking to be on top thats great.
Total war games requires very low apm and infact less thinking and strategic / tactical thinking then starcraft does even if its supposed to be focusing on that

making a game about strategical/tactical thinking only sucks becouse a) it becouse no challenge for most humans to play, infact it ususaly ends up needing less thinking then the game that requires more apm becouse more things happens requireing you to think more and faster.

and clicking skill is very similare to instrumental skills in terms of that your able to get ur brain do what you want in a high speed, wich can be suprisingly hard sometimes (i play guitar and piano somtimes so)

The general art of real time strategy is that the mix of strategy/tactical thinking with the abbilitey to make ur hands follow ur brains order in high speed somekind of challenge thus actuly giving the game a reson to be cmpetive

you seems to want to make bfme - a map that already is Really easy to play easier. All bfme needs is a decent apm 80-100apm or so and common sense and you will do fine with the known players - it aint harder then that. 80-100apm aint much to ask for either.

mainly becouse the macro aspect of the game is gone,tactical aspects are big, where u figth at wich location and so on and how ur units are placed in the figth makes big diffrences in bfme strategicly the game doesnt require much. thus making it a game that requre some thinking but not much and some apm but not much. making it easier is just zzz. (infact just random group all ur units and a move and then use heroes and you will do OK, still a player that groups everything good and place rigth units at rigth spot will do better then you but its a start)

and why play wc3 if your gonna rp?, they got lotro online,wow and other online games for that

oh and about ur army comparisson, well if you make it a thinking game the skill needed to play it wont  be to high becouse most positining and army placement is just common sense and not a very advanced matter in real time strategy games, so no they wont play better ...
 
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